https://wiki.endsoftwarepatents.org/wiki?title=Infringement_is_unavoidable_and_clearance_is_impossible&feed=atom&action=history
Infringement is unavoidable and clearance is impossible - Revision history
2024-03-28T15:45:38Z
Revision history for this page on the wiki
MediaWiki 1.31.16
https://wiki.endsoftwarepatents.org/w/index.php?title=Infringement_is_unavoidable_and_clearance_is_impossible&diff=38603&oldid=prev
Panos Alevropoulos: add navbox
2023-12-28T11:44:38Z
<p>add navbox</p>
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<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #222; text-align: center;">Revision as of 11:44, 28 December 2023</td>
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Panos Alevropoulos
https://wiki.endsoftwarepatents.org/w/index.php?title=Infringement_is_unavoidable_and_clearance_is_impossible&diff=34415&oldid=prev
Ciaran: as are '''patent clearance''' or '''freedom-to-operate''' searches, because:
2013-07-24T17:11:11Z
<p>as are '''patent clearance''' or '''freedom-to-operate''' searches, because:</p>
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<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #222; text-align: center;">Revision as of 17:11, 24 July 2013</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l1" >Line 1:</td>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">{{navbox}}</del></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Avoiding [[software patents]] is difficult or impossible<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">, as are '''patent clearance''' or '''freedom-to-operate''' searches, because:</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Avoiding [[software patents]] is difficult or impossible<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">.</del></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline"># There are so many software patents</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline"># Computer programs easily contain tens or hundreds of thousands of ideas</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline"># The language for describing computer functionality is [[abstract]] and arbitrary</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Even a company with a legal team as large as Microsoft's (and with as many software patents) cannot avoid patent infringement.  See [[Microsoft#Microsoft's patent infringements|Microsoft's patent infringements]].</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Even a company with a legal team as large as Microsoft's (and with as many software patents) cannot avoid patent infringement.  See [[Microsoft#Microsoft's patent infringements|Microsoft's patent infringements]].</div></td></tr>
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Ciaran
https://wiki.endsoftwarepatents.org/w/index.php?title=Infringement_is_unavoidable_and_clearance_is_impossible&diff=34411&oldid=prev
Ciaran: Ciaran moved page Infringement is unavoidable to Infringement is unavoidable and clearance is impossible: more complete (these might become two articles in the future)
2013-07-24T17:08:29Z
<p>Ciaran moved page <a href="/wiki/Infringement_is_unavoidable" class="mw-redirect" title="Infringement is unavoidable">Infringement is unavoidable</a> to <a href="/wiki/Infringement_is_unavoidable_and_clearance_is_impossible" title="Infringement is unavoidable and clearance is impossible">Infringement is unavoidable and clearance is impossible</a>: more complete (these might become two articles in the future)</p>
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<td colspan="1" style="background-color: #fff; color: #222; text-align: center;">Revision as of 17:08, 24 July 2013</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-notice" lang="en"><div class="mw-diff-empty">(No difference)</div>
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Ciaran
https://wiki.endsoftwarepatents.org/w/index.php?title=Infringement_is_unavoidable_and_clearance_is_impossible&diff=34410&oldid=prev
Ciaran: /* External links */ * [http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20130715054823358 How Many Patents Must Be Read to Clear All Patents Rights on Software? ~PolR], 15 July 2013, '''Groklaw'''
2013-07-24T13:58:11Z
<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">External links: </span> * [http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20130715054823358 How Many Patents Must Be Read to Clear All Patents Rights on Software? ~PolR], 15 July 2013, '''<a href="/wiki/Groklaw" title="Groklaw">Groklaw</a>'''</span></p>
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<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #222; text-align: center;">Revision as of 13:58, 24 July 2013</td>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [http://web.archive.org/web/20080309060603/http://www.davidstreitfeld.com/archive/technology/extortion.shtml E-Commerce Battles 'Me'-Commerce] - ''"If you're selling online, at the most recent count there are 4,319 patents you could be violating"''</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [http://web.archive.org/web/20080309060603/http://www.davidstreitfeld.com/archive/technology/extortion.shtml E-Commerce Battles 'Me'-Commerce] - ''"If you're selling online, at the most recent count there are 4,319 patents you could be violating"''</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=999961 Ignoring Patents], 3 July 2007, '''[[Mark A. Lemley]]''' - ''"both researchers and companies in component industries simply ignore patents."''</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=999961 Ignoring Patents], 3 July 2007, '''[[Mark A. Lemley]]''' - ''"both researchers and companies in component industries simply ignore patents."''</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">* [http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20130715054823358 How Many Patents Must Be Read to Clear All Patents Rights on Software? ~PolR], 15 July 2013, '''[[Groklaw]]'''</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==References==</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==References==</div></td></tr>
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Ciaran
https://wiki.endsoftwarepatents.org/w/index.php?title=Infringement_is_unavoidable_and_clearance_is_impossible&diff=33752&oldid=prev
Hijinx at 20:07, 9 February 2013
2013-02-09T20:07:54Z
<p></p>
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<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #222; text-align: center;">Revision as of 20:07, 9 February 2013</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l4" >Line 4:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 4:</td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Even a company with a legal team as large as Microsoft's (and with as many software patents) cannot avoid patent infringement.  See [[Microsoft#Microsoft's patent infringements|Microsoft's patent infringements]].</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Even a company with a legal team as large as Microsoft's (and with as many software patents) cannot avoid patent infringement.  See [[Microsoft#Microsoft's patent infringements|Microsoft's patent infringements]].</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Searching for patents in order to avoid infringement is in practice <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">impossible</del>, partly because of the sheer number of them, and partly because there is no standardisation of the (necessarily [[software is too abstract|abstract]]) vocabulary that is used. A system in which "components" send "messages" to each other can be technically identical to one in which "agents" transmit "documents".</div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Searching for patents in order to avoid infringement is <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">impossible </ins>in practice, partly because of the sheer number of them, and partly because there is no standardisation of the (necessarily [[software is too abstract|abstract]]) vocabulary that is used. A system in which "components" send "messages" to each other can be technically identical to one in which "agents" transmit "documents".</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==Examples==</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==Examples==</div></td></tr>
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Hijinx
https://wiki.endsoftwarepatents.org/w/index.php?title=Infringement_is_unavoidable_and_clearance_is_impossible&diff=33751&oldid=prev
Hijinx at 20:05, 9 February 2013
2013-02-09T20:05:29Z
<p></p>
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<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #222; text-align: center;">Revision as of 20:05, 9 February 2013</td>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Avoiding [[software patents]] is difficult or impossible.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Avoiding [[software patents]] is difficult or impossible.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Even a company with a <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">lot of funding and a large </del>legal team (<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">who who supports of </del>software patents)<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">, namely [[Microsoft]], </del>cannot avoid patent infringement.  See [[Microsoft#Microsoft's patent infringements|Microsoft's patent infringements]].</div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Even a company with a legal team <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">as large as Microsoft's </ins>(<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">and with as many </ins>software patents) cannot avoid patent infringement.  See [[Microsoft#Microsoft's patent infringements|Microsoft's patent infringements]].</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Searching for patents in order to avoid infringement is in practice impossible, partly because of the sheer number of them, and partly because there is no standardisation of the (necessarily [[software is too abstract|abstract]]) vocabulary that is used. A system in which "components" send "messages" to each other can be technically identical to one in which "agents" transmit "documents".</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Searching for patents in order to avoid infringement is in practice impossible, partly because of the sheer number of them, and partly because there is no standardisation of the (necessarily [[software is too abstract|abstract]]) vocabulary that is used. A system in which "components" send "messages" to each other can be technically identical to one in which "agents" transmit "documents".</div></td></tr>
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Hijinx
https://wiki.endsoftwarepatents.org/w/index.php?title=Infringement_is_unavoidable_and_clearance_is_impossible&diff=32148&oldid=prev
Ciaran: /* External links */ link
2012-03-10T18:40:22Z
<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">External links: </span> link</span></p>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [http://www.ifso.ie/documents/rms-2004-05-24.html#avoid The difficulties of avoiding patents], 24 May 2004, '''Richard Stallman'''</div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [http://www.ifso.ie/documents/rms-2004-05-24.html#avoid The difficulties of avoiding patents], 24 May 2004, '''<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">[[</ins>Richard Stallman<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">]]</ins>'''</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [http://web.archive.org/web/20080309060603/http://www.davidstreitfeld.com/archive/technology/extortion.shtml E-Commerce Battles 'Me'-Commerce] - ''"If you're selling online, at the most recent count there are 4,319 patents you could be violating"''</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [http://web.archive.org/web/20080309060603/http://www.davidstreitfeld.com/archive/technology/extortion.shtml E-Commerce Battles 'Me'-Commerce] - ''"If you're selling online, at the most recent count there are 4,319 patents you could be violating"''</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=999961 Ignoring Patents], 3 July 2007, '''[[Mark A. Lemley]]''' - ''"both researchers and companies in component industries simply ignore patents."''</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=999961 Ignoring Patents], 3 July 2007, '''[[Mark A. Lemley]]''' - ''"both researchers and companies in component industries simply ignore patents."''</div></td></tr>
</table>
Ciaran
https://wiki.endsoftwarepatents.org/w/index.php?title=Infringement_is_unavoidable_and_clearance_is_impossible&diff=30348&oldid=prev
Ciaran: /* Related pages on {{SITENAME}} */ Google's chief legal officer, David Drummond, says that a smart phone "''might involve as many as 250,000 (largely questionable) pat
2011-08-23T02:31:01Z
<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">Related pages on {{SITENAME}}: </span> <a href="/wiki/Google" title="Google">Google</a>'s chief legal officer, David Drummond, says that a <a href="/wiki/Phone_patent_litigation" title="Phone patent litigation">smart phone</a> "''might involve as many as 250,000 (largely questionable) pat</span></p>
<table class="diff diff-contentalign-left" data-mw="interface">
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<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #222; text-align: center;">Revision as of 02:31, 23 August 2011</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l27" >Line 27:</td>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>[[GIF]] is actually covered by two patents: both covering the LZW data compression algorithm that was patented twice. Now, that's not supposed to happen but it does, and the reason it happens is that the two patents are not written in the same way. You have to look at them and think about them carefully to see that they are both covering the same computation. Now if they were patents on some kind of chemical process you could say, you could have a quick way to see if you need to think about them, because you could ask yourself "are the same chemicals going in, are the same chemicals coming out? Hmm, if they are the same I guess I'd better compare these". But there's nothing like that to help you comparing these two patents on different ways of describing the same mathematics. Fact is, you could describe the same mathematics in ways that don't look exactly the same at first sight. Only when you think about them do you see it's the same mathematics. And the patent office doesn't have time. I'm not going to say that some patent examiner did this because he was stupid - the fact is they have only 17 hours per patent application, and they don't have time to take this application and every other application and spend a lot of time comparing them.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>[[GIF]] is actually covered by two patents: both covering the LZW data compression algorithm that was patented twice. Now, that's not supposed to happen but it does, and the reason it happens is that the two patents are not written in the same way. You have to look at them and think about them carefully to see that they are both covering the same computation. Now if they were patents on some kind of chemical process you could say, you could have a quick way to see if you need to think about them, because you could ask yourself "are the same chemicals going in, are the same chemicals coming out? Hmm, if they are the same I guess I'd better compare these". But there's nothing like that to help you comparing these two patents on different ways of describing the same mathematics. Fact is, you could describe the same mathematics in ways that don't look exactly the same at first sight. Only when you think about them do you see it's the same mathematics. And the patent office doesn't have time. I'm not going to say that some patent examiner did this because he was stupid - the fact is they have only 17 hours per patent application, and they don't have time to take this application and every other application and spend a lot of time comparing them.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div></blockquote></div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div></blockquote></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">==Programs can use thousands of ideas==</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">[[David Martin]], patent risk expert:</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"><blockquote></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">"If you're selling online, at the most recent count there are 4,319 patents you could be violating," said David E. Martin, chief executive of M-Cam Inc., an Arlington, Va.-based risk-management firm specializing in patents. "If you also planned to advertise, receive payments for or plan shipments of your goods, you would need to be concerned about approximately 11,000."<ref>{{cite web|</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">|url=http://www.davidstreitfeld.com/archive/technology/extortion.shtml</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">|title=E-Commerce Battles 'Me'-Commerce</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">|archiveurl=http://web.archive.org/web/20080309060603/http://www.davidstreitfeld.com/archive/technology/extortion.shtml</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">|archivedate=March 9th 2008}}</ref></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></blockquote></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">[[Google]]'s chief legal officer, David Drummond, says that a [[Phone patent litigation|smart phone]] "''might involve as many as 250,000 (largely questionable) patent claims''".<ref>http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2011/aug/04/apple-patents-android-expensive-google</ref></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==Related pages on {{SITENAME}}==</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==Related pages on {{SITENAME}}==</div></td></tr>
</table>
Ciaran
https://wiki.endsoftwarepatents.org/w/index.php?title=Infringement_is_unavoidable_and_clearance_is_impossible&diff=30347&oldid=prev
Ciaran: /* Related pages on {{SITENAME}} */ dud link
2011-08-23T02:25:30Z
<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">Related pages on {{SITENAME}}: </span> dud link</span></p>
<table class="diff diff-contentalign-left" data-mw="interface">
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<col class="diff-marker" />
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<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #222; text-align: center;">Revision as of 02:25, 23 August 2011</td>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[Software is too abstract, software patent quality is terrible]]</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[Software is too abstract, software patent quality is terrible]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[The disclosure is useless]]</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[The disclosure is useless]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">* [[Infringement is unavoidable]]</del></div></td><td colspan="2"> </td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==External links==</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==External links==</div></td></tr>
</table>
Ciaran
https://wiki.endsoftwarepatents.org/w/index.php?title=Infringement_is_unavoidable_and_clearance_is_impossible&diff=30280&oldid=prev
Ciaran: /* Related pages on {{SITENAME}} */ more
2011-08-22T00:29:08Z
<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">Related pages on {{SITENAME}}: </span> more</span></p>
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<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #222; text-align: center;">Revision as of 00:29, 22 August 2011</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l31" >Line 31:</td>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[How to avoid a specific software patent]]</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[How to avoid a specific software patent]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">* [[Quality of software patents is particularly bad]]</del></div></td><td colspan="2"> </td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[Criminalising patent infringement is draconian]]</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[Criminalising patent infringement is draconian]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[Insurance against patent litigation doesn't work]] - also uninsurable</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[Insurance against patent litigation doesn't work]] - also uninsurable</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[Cost of patent searches to avoid infringement]]</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[Cost of patent searches to avoid infringement]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">* [[Software patents produce legal uncertainty]]</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">* [[Software is too abstract, software patent quality is terrible]]</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">* [[The disclosure is useless]]</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">* [[Infringement is unavoidable]]</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==External links==</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==External links==</div></td></tr>
</table>
Ciaran